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Jeremy Neuringer

Moving up from Focus ST to MKZ 3.0T AWD or Fusion Sport

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Folks, I currently have a Focus ST which I love and hate.  Everything but the seat I love, but I am now unable to take longer trips because the seat....  well..  is too aggressive..  

 

I test drove a Fusion sport which I liked..  40K with all the options..  But also want to try the MKZ with 3.0T, AWD and Drivers package.

I asked at the dealer to try theirs (without the drivers package) and they basically wouldn't let me because it was "too awful".

 

Is this really true?  I read a recent review (several actually) and C&D said "it's like riding on 4 basketballs.  Not glowing....   

Anyone know if their car had the driver's package or not?  

 

Anyone know if that resolves the problem?  

 

Any thoughts?  

 

There is about $20k difference between the 2 cars I'm looking at...  but..

LOVE the panoramic roof, the huge sounds system, and the fit and feel of the MKZ....

 

Jeremy

 

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A dealer wouldn't let you test drive a car because it was too awful?? Uh...something is awry with that.

 

I wouldn't let Car & Driver influence me much either. The car without the drivers package is a nice riding nice driving car. With the driver's package, it handles better and the ride is just a tad firmer. The car that C&D tested had optional summer-only high performance tires which generated awesome handling results with apparently a sacrifice in ride quality. I seriously doubt it felt like riding on 4 basketballs, though.

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I have no idea what C&D meant about the basketballs. I have had my '17 MKZ 3.0T Reserve AWD non-driver's package for nearly 2 months. I came from a '14 Cadillac ATS 3.6, a car often said to out-handle a BMW 3-Series. The Lincoln rides and handles superbly. It can't quite match the ATS at the limit, but it handles just fine. It's also faster than the ATS (0-60 4.8 vs 5.6 according to C&D).

 

I have no regrets about getting the MKZ...

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Honestly,  C&D is just throwing their review together without real serious interest...

 

C&D didn't even test the car with 93 octane, so they're already wrong about the car having 400 HP/TQ. Even if they did put premium, most of the time they only use 91 octane and that still wouldn't be good enough for the true 3.0T performance. times. Their times are penalized due to lower octane quality, which already tells us the block wasn't making 400 crank HP/TQ rating for sure. Same goes for AutoVlog's little fun 0 - 60 test, he was on 87 octane due to using a dealership's stock. They never put premium fuel in these cars. Even if AutoVlog added premium fuel, his short testing time would have not been enough for the Learned Octane Ratio to adjust and allow the full octane optimization.

 

Part of me really doesn't care what others think, but its just a shame such a poor review is going to misinform the readers and feed the ego of haters. Making Lincoln look like they still aren't trying at all. It's not perfect, but they (Lincoln) did improve.

 

The basketball comment is an opinionated comment, nothing factual as it will depend on the driver. For me, I find the MKZ on Super Sports nice and pleasant, not ruining my "Quiet Luxury" when I want it. I would be a bit worried if I couldn't hear any minor road noise honestly, but on your standard road its quiet. The best thing is to still go out there and test the car yourself and ask other owners of the car. Some of us were positive to take the risk as first time buyers, and I am still happy with what I have gotten. I feel owners will always give the best and most fair opinion in regards to ownership of a vehicle, as we'll say something if things go wrong for sure.

 

Anyways, I will say your dealer...is weird to make that comment and not letingt you try the car out. Maybe he didn't take you seriously if you're young and driving a Focus ST? Yes, sadly those old crones still do exist out there who stereotype. I would find another dealer to test drive. 

 

If you want to save a buck, consider the Fusion Sport. But if you rather get the quality build in every aspect over a Fusion, go with the MKZ. People complain of the price but don't realize how much more they're getting between Fusion and MKZ for 2017. The rift in improvement is much greater than for 2013 - 2016.

Edited by Zalvern

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This is all very helpful.  I am indeed comparing the Fusion sport with the MKZ.  but things about the MKZ that i CANT get on the fusion...  

  1. Upgraded seat, with lumbar massage,
  2. Crazy awesome convertible-like roof
  3. 75+ HP
  4. style, fit, finish
  5. 20 speakers
  6. but...  $20k more...

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Two great choices for sure.  Don't forget about other Lincoln pluses such as included maintenance, pick up and drop off when service is required, etc.

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Anyone know how price negotiable a 60k sticker car would be (above and beyond the available Ford incentives) ?  would 5k be asking too much?  too little?

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This is all very helpful. I am indeed comparing the Fusion sport with the MKZ. but things about the MKZ that i CANT get on the fusion...

  • Upgraded seat, with lumbar massage,
  • Crazy awesome convertible-like roof
  • 75+ HP
  • style, fit, finish
  • 20 speakers
  • but... $20k more...
It'll vary by the person, to find justification in a price tag.

 

My sticker price difference between my choice of Ford Sport and MKZ was roughly 18,000 which isn't counting incentives and X-plan.

 

X-plan was more effective for the MKZ do to its higher price. As I got a Black Label. Resale value is much better for Black Label than Reserve and below MKZs. Fusions in general will never have good resale.

 

I'll try to list everything the fully loaded MKZ offers that may incite why it costs a lot more: I did check out a Fusion Sport for fun and comparison and personally, and I find a loaded MKZ justified over a Fusion Sport...which is stuck as an SE model (the tail light difference between Sport and Platnium would bother me).

 

3.0T Engine: Its more than just 75 HP and 20 TQ over the Sport's 2.7L. You're getting better coolant and oil efficiency, stronger overall engine build, bigger turbochagers, better fueling system (very important for bigger power). A bunch of other more durable tech and parts to make it powerful and smooth. Sure you can tune for cheaper, but it does sacrifice reliability and durability that a bigger and stronger block design will excel out. Plus tuning a 3.0T will just result in even greater gains where as the 2.7L tuned still will lack higher speed Horsepower against a stock MKZ. I personally will tune but stay on stock tune for daily driving most of the time, its thst good and D and S gear are very noticeable in performance difference.

 

You also get Lincoln Drive Control to change road feel to your liking. Another big REALLY nice feature is Auto Hold. It even makes launching the MKZ super easy with its stock tune.

 

Revel Ultima: Any music lover will love this. Extremely clear and loud sound potential that makes long drives much more pleasant. Not even the European luxury cars or Cadillac (except maybe the CT6) can fight against this one. Lincoln went all out here for audiophiles.

 

Fun fact: The last two speakers are small ones right up in the car's headliner with Ultima, many people miss this and thus miscount all 20 speakers.

 

Seats: More options and I find the leather seats more comfortable personally, making it a pure improvement. Not saying the Fusions are bad either, and especially the unique Black Label style that gives it more theme and distinction. A Fusion Sport is literally stuck to one interior choice (but Reserve Driver's MKZ has this problem too). Interior flexibility something Ford/Lincoln needs to work on.

 

Headlights and Lighting: the fluid motion of the MKZ is cool, especially as they go off and on during turn signals. This is actually more pleasant to other drivers as DRLs since the lights do not flash immediately off and on. I also like the car can be 100% LED lighting. The HIDs aren't bad though, but I like cool white color temperature over warm.

 

With driver's package which I consider a must for top notch performance, Dynamic Torque Vectoring helps balance out the car from less of the FWD negatives. The AWD system is more beefed up as well and puts more power to the rear when needed (70% instead of just 50%). This power will optimize too sending to the rear tires individually, so launching with good summer rubber feels great once you learn how to throttle the stock tune properly.

 

I didn't care for the pana-roof, but it is something cool for those who like that bigger light and open space. Only downside is the headliner is demoted on Black Label models, if getting Reserve its no different.

 

I love Diamond Black Metallic, which is like a throwback to Tuxedo Black Metallic. Fusion Sport only has Shadow Black...

 

One thing I personally like? I rarely see MKZs in general (even the Zephyrs!) And they're not bad cars for long term ownership. So the car feels more special. As humans, we all like to differentiate ourselves to stand out in some way or form. Even now I do not see much 2013 to 2016 MKZs. You see Fusions EVERYWHERE.

 

Oh and warranty...can be much better especially if getting a Black Label. Plus I always get better treatment from my Lincoln dealers than Ford, I take my 2014 Fusion to them as well.

 

Lastly you get rentals much easier with said Lincoln dealers. Even pickup and delivery for 2017 if you can arrange reasonable exchange time and distance.

 

In the end a fully loaded Sport is still like the plebian compared to a MKZ, its quality in all aspects, haha. You really just decide if its within your budget and offers enough things for the price tag.

 

Shop around too and if wanting a loaded MKZ, I recommend Black Label over Reserve, as it gets a prestige boost and improves resale. KBB has nearly a 7,000 resale price gap between 2015 Black Label and fully loaded Reserve, which makes the choice to buy extremely obvious (and this is only for estimated dealer trade in value, not private sale).

 

Other things I like is a Hood strut and headlight covers, which reduces the amount of dirt getting into the engine bay. Trunk liner is fully enclosed (Fusions expose the upper half). More underbody shielding for less under road grime. We get power Auto folding mirrors, power decklid, no stupid RC antenna or distinguished rear spoiler. At least the calipers get painted too for Driver's MKZ.

 

Just many little things that I account for when factoring in the price increase. But its up to you to determine what is enough for satisfaction and your budget. But I would not call the money spent on an MKZ a waste, depending on one's expectations.

Edited by Zalvern

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Lincoln should give you a cut of their advertising budget Zalvern. Well said.

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Ha, just sharing my experience from owning the car up to 5000 miles now. That's just really a quick scratch pad of all the enhancements done to the car, as there are still many more. While I can praise the car, I do know of its drawbacks as well.

 

I've been having issues with mine though minor...its something to do with the ACM (Audio Control Module). Sometimes my chime sound effects and sensor beeps default to the instrument panel harsh tone, like there is an electrical voltage issue somewhere. I've checked all grounding points, and even reset the battery BSM, IPC reset, and ACM reset all using FORScan. The problem happens randomly when starting up the car. I know its not my battery, as I upgraded to the massive XS Power D4900. The car voltage sensors read around 13.00 - 13.30 volts while driving, but my battery's charge level doesn't deplete harshly.

 

This Audio Chime bug has really been the only annoyance. The other is the gurgling heater core, which sounds like air being trapped in the system...but coolant level does not change. Ford/Lincoln has a TSB for it as a minor side issue on 2015 - 2017 Fusions, Continentals, and MKZs. You only hear the gurgling sounds when throttling while the car is parked. No adverse effects to coolant temperature has been noticed.

 

Besides those two issues, everything else has been perfect. The 6F transmission is just something you have to accept for what it is, as it does not like being cold. This is something that is very important to get to operating temperature (which can take awhile) before driving the car hard. Very sensitive to fluid level as well. So torque shifts may feel heavier as temperatures drop and the car takes longer to warm up.. In the MKZ it will perhaps be the weakest performer when under temp, and result in triggering torque management a lot to keep the shifting force easy on the gears. This behavior will apply to all 6F series transmissions. It's not bad at all when its warmed up though (185 - 205 degrees F)

Edited by Zalvern

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I agree with Zalvern.  I have a 2016 Lincoln MKZ which I brought in April but had looked at a Ford Fusion Platinum and just couldn't bring myself to buying it.  It looked and FELT alot cheaper than the MKZ.  I bought a 2016 MKZ Reserve.  I couldn't afford the Black Label but boy did I want it as it was in Cranberry Red over Black/Red leather interior and felt like another class of vehicle altogether.  I couldn't stop looking at it.  I came to my senses though and leased the 2016 MKZ Reserve with majority of all I wanted...only lacking THX radio and front sensors.  The 2017 is much improved from what I've seen at the dealership and I don't think you will feel cheated or disappointed.

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I didn't care for the pana-roof, but it is something cool for those who like that bigger light and open space. Only downside is the headliner is demoted on Black Label models, if getting Reserve its no different.

 

 

 

Great post above, but I didn't want to quote the whole thing here.  

 

Can anyone who has the Pano roof confirm that the Alcantara Headliner is in fact in place.   I've seen Window Stickers on BL 17s and 18s where both are listed.  I didn't take notice (or remember) when I looked at some MKZs.  I hope to order soon, maybe even this week.   :2thumbs:

Edited by fusionff

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One thing to consider is that you might find a used Fusion Sport and save even more money over buying new.

 

If you want a used MKZ 3.0, you may have to wait another year or more to find any options.

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Greetings All,

 

Similar situation here, only I'm coming out of an RS. That car is incredible, but the ride is indeed like all the reviews say....I'll call it purposeful. My wife calls it torture. 

 

Due to that, we just finished a deal for the MKZ to replace the RS. I'm sad inside, she's thrilled. That being said, I'm also pretty excited. I'm buying a '17 Black Label with the 3.0 AWD, it does have the driver's package among others (the big motor, AWD and driver's package were my must-haves, if I were to even entertain trading the RS in). 

 

I don't expect it to touch the RS' handling or speed, but at 4.8 seconds to 60 it sounds like it'll come close. I see that Livernois has done some tuning magic for this car as well. 

 

I'm expecting luxury, and that's what I need from it, with the occasional spirited drive by me...I can't imagine I'll be disappointed, but I haven't even sit or driven the BL yet, I'm buying this car out of state and have only experienced this motor set up in a '17 Select...

 

Will I fall in love with this thing, or will I cry myself to sleep every night? lol

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I have had a fox body Mustang with nitrous, an ‘03 M3, and an ‘08 Jeep SRT8 with exhaust, CAI, and tune. All were great cars and provided a lot of enjoyment. However, my MKZ with Livernois tune can massage and cool my back, adjust automatically to many road and weather conditions, drive through snow without any issue, and accelerate with serious authority. I love this car as much as any mentioned above and feel it is a great blend of comfort, performance, and usefulness. I think both you and your wife will enjoy this car a lot especially the way you optioned it.

 

Report back with an update and best of luck!

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You'll love it!  Congratulations and welcome to the forums.

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Stoked, you won't be disappointed with a Black Label Z, and start a thread with pictures when you get it.  Yours will be here a lot sooner than mine, which should arrive late next month.  I wish I had ordered earlier now, but I wasn't in a rush.

 

Congrats and Welcome aboard.

Edited by fusionff

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Thanks Gents...Wow, sounds like I might actually be jealous of my wife getting to drive it all the time by the way it sounds, haha....Maybe I can get her to take the Shelby to work a couple of days ;)

 

I'm more and more intrigued the more I read...Honestly I wasn't looking for more than something comfortable and luxurious with a bit of pep that would keep me interested on long cruises...Sounds like I'm in for much more indeed!

 

Anyone see this "Red Flame Chromaflair" paint in person? Looks like a deep red in pics, but the brochures make it look more like a candy apple...Does it really color shift?

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I picked up the car last night, and so far, I love it. I drove it back to OKC from Dallas this morning. Very nice ride...definitely has some get up...

 

I think we'll enjoy this one!

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Congrats on your new Mkz Enjoy it :2thumbs:

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Congrats... Seriously will look at a used 2017/2018 MKZ 3.0T in a few years... The front end styling just blows the doors off other vehicles.  

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I'm bored and scouring the forums today. Since there isn't a whole lot going on in this forum usually it's just a bunch of older threads so this one will get bumped.  I started looking for a new car about 2 years ago when my bronco died for the umpteenth time and I was tired of fixing it.  So I set out with the idea of about 40K dollars as a MAX. I test drove a Fusion Sport and a Mustang GT.  I decided since I take really long trips that the Fusion sport would probably provide a little more comfort.  I did look at a Focus RS but as soon as I sat in it and got out and told the salesman no.  I'm not claustraphobic as I work in small places on aircraft but holy shit the interior on a focus in general is super cramped.  Not driving cross country in that.  From reading the reviews it's a pretty rough ride as well.

 

So I took a fusion sport out for a spin.  Had some get up and go.  Didn't care for the laggy shifts nor did I like that when you let off the gas it took a little bit for the engine to actually shut down as well.  Snapping the throttle closed it would still pull for a bit.  But I figured a tune could fix most of that.  The sticking point though.... the Stereo.  HATED the sony system.  Has the same issue my brothers 2012 Focus has.  Way overpowering muddy bass.  And if you try and tune it down it disappears.  THey wanted the car gone though.  Told me they wouldn't charge me for the moon roof since It wasn't a necessity.  They came back with a 34600 out the door today.  Then brought over the sales manager when I asked for the break down of incentives and the manager came over and offered me 34 out the door. That's not bad for a 41625 MSRP and no haggling.  So in the end I didn't impulse buy and told them I'd call them in a couple days after I had thought about it.  Talkin to some friends and they said I should go see what Lincoln has to offer because they put a Revel Audio system in it.  Me being the audiophile type I am decided to go see if it was all that great.  Wasn't gonna buy one mind you because it was way out of my price but I decided to check it out.  Told the salesman that I wasn't buying but I heard the revel ultima was the system to have.  And I wanted to check it out if it was alright.  He told me it's no problem and unlocked the door on a reserve and went off to get the keys.  I sat in that seat and immediately realized I had made a huge mistake.  The car felt so much nicer than the Fusion.  The seat was that much more comfortable.  The smell of the leather and everything just looked nicer inside.  He remote states it and the cooled seats turn on which was a nice touch.  And then the audio system.  My god.... he tried so hard to lock me in a lease and I was super tempted but I knew I had to buy one and it would have to be all the way at the top.  So I saved for over another year and a half and this April dropped my deposit to order my MKZ Black Label from the factory.  It was built this week and estimated delivery is in 2 weeks.  I can't freaking wait.  Now it's just dealing with the dealership BS now that they found out I most likely won't be going through them for the ceramic coating (they partnered with a local shop) and getting some other options they wanted to sell me they are super pissed.  Got pretty hateful over the phone but I expected it.  The salesman that I worked with and I kind of hit it off in a bromance and he hooked me up by putting all the incentives and promises on my order contract and the sales manager signed it just to ensure they can't try to reneg on the deal.  I mean what they promised is actually their incentives right now anyways so it works out the same but either way it's below invoice cost so they have been working really hard to sell me so much shit.

 

So I get it and it will be taken to Kansas City for several days to get the paint correction and Feynlab Self Heal plus+Topcoat installed and then I just gotta work out the rest of the 2600 miles before the tune goes on.  Diverter Valve and intercooler are already ordered and I'm truly debating the Darkstar or CPE Rear motor mount.  Only time will tell...

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It's really a great car before I bought my 2017 MKZ 3.0T I drove several other makes before I drove my MKZ and not only did I feel the inside looked better then most other cars I drove but I really felt the quality of the materials used seemed better. Anyway I could go on and on .... Great car and good buy!

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12k mile update...The car went in for a leaking PTU seal about two months ago and last week, another oil change.

 

Lincoln service continues to impress. Car is picked up, serviced and brought back clean each time.

 

I'm seeing some abnormal and definitely premature wear on the driver's seat. It'll be going back in for that soon, today I spent about 5 hours on the body making it all pretty for the wife...

post-2870-0-16104700-1528662066_thumb.jpg

post-2870-0-11185000-1528662079_thumb.jpg

post-2870-0-06256800-1528662093_thumb.jpg

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Looks great but lord 5 hours? I don't have that kind of time. That's why I'm going to be installing feynlabs self heal plus with topcoat so I don't have to worry too mufh about it. It should look pretty most of the time.

 

The seat wear concerns me though. Got any pics?

Edited by FunktasticLucky

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