Davisjl

I really don't understand your point. My post was to your question on Why others don't feel like you. I answered it. If you buy a car that you KNOW gets 38 miles per gallon even though it is listed at 45... and you decided the feature set/price is worth the difference, and then on the back side you get an additional 1,050.00... Most will be happy. To put it bluntly... My car is performing in EXACTLY the manner in which I expected it to perform. I have acknowledge that you are not happy and you have every right to keep fighting for what you want to make you happy... but don't expect the rest of the world that had the foresight to check the real world numbers and make an better informed decision than you follow in your footsteps. I don't think anywhere in the tread I attacked you... could be wrong, but that was not my intent. <Sarcasm>It sounds like GM is pretty happy you are no longer buying their cars. Go try one of those German cars and see how you get treated.</Sarcasm> I just traded a 2011 Audi A4 that needed a new engine due to a known issue with the installation of incorrect piston sizes... While Audi/VW has/had knowledge of this issue, they claimed that burning a quart of oil every 500 to 1000 miles was "normal" and expected. When this issue scored the cylinder walls of my Audi (mind you it had every service completed by the Audi dealership with full records), they walked away from it saying it was past the warranty period... Now, I put 30,000 miles per year on my car so wait and see what kind of crap Audi/VW will be in, in about 3-5 years when all these 2.0 turbo engines start failing... (btw, Audi has just recently very quietly started to replace the pistons of known cars while not saying there is an issue). Ford has made an offer to it's owners and in my view it is/was a fair offer. You obviously feel differently, but you were taking that 45 mpg as fact and most of us were not. You situation is going to be different than most others out there. Go fight your fight... and you getting more than the $ 1,050, I think that is absolutely wonderful; However, if you can't understand why most of us that KNEW it only got 38 mpg are happy to take an additional $ 1,050 dollars, then there is not much else to say. Point of clarification... I was not honest in what I posted above... my car is not performing EXACTLY as I expected. It's getting around 41mpg for the life of the car so far, so it is performing about 8% better than expected ;)

I plan on using that $ 1,050 to buy something on Amazon, I've never trusted Ebay... ;) BTW, I have fun every day I drive my car... YMMV.

You can't answer your question as it is asked... as there are too many variables that you leave out as in what was misrepresented. Did you buy a Toaster and get a Microwave? Now, to take your example and make it more in line with the issue at hand with the MPG re-rating by Ford... I want to buy a $ 3,000 Sony TV on Ebay that is listed to cost you $ 8.00 per month to run on average (it's even printed right there on the box!!!). I do some research and see that the actual usage is going to be more like $ 9.25 per month (a 16% increase in cost of usage). I then look around and see every other TV in the same class is right about at the $ 9.25 per month usage cost in the real world. The TV I am looking at has more features than any of the other TV's AND it's cheaper than any of the other cars with similar feature sets. So I buy the TV... when I get the TV I find out that it truly does cost $ 9.25 per month to use it. However, it truly is an amazing TV in the way it looks and the features it has. A few weeks later, Sony repackages the TV and changes the energy rating to the real world $ 9.25 per month. I'm a bit frustrated, but I am very happy with the TV and it was much cheaper than all the other TV's on the market. Then, out of the blue Sony sends me a check for $ 75.00 ($ 1.25 per month * 60 months) saying they made a mistake on the energy rating and are refunding me the difference in energy cost for a 5 year period. ...I then say, let's have steak for dinner tonight... Does that answer your question... ???? I'm not defending their mistake... I agree they screwed up. I am defending what they did to compensate me for their mistake. I feel it was a very fair compensation. BTW, it's 15.5% difference in MPG not 18%. I think you original had it correct at 16% earlier in the tread, but have morphed it into 18% somewhere along the way. As for what you would have done, I really don't care because it doesn't have anything to do with me and I've already said you have the right to be upset and feel what ever way you want to feel about it. You asked why everyone else doesn't feel like you... my post was an answer to your question. I took the time to research the properties of the car that meant the most to my purchasing the car and not trusting what a salesman told me or what was printed on the sticker (BTW, I didn't pay that Sticker Price Either). It is a great car and regardless of what MPG it gets, it's value is much greater than the price I paid... Heck, there was not even a premium for the Hybrid... so there are people driving my car and paid the same price I did that only get's mid 20's at best... So, to me the $ 1,050 is just a bonus. As I've stated before to you... if you'd like, I'd be happy to help you research your next car so you don't get burned again. Just shoot me a message and give me the details of what is important to you. I promise I won't use any data off the sticker ;)

SMH.... Why? Because a large majority of them KNEW the real world MPG value PRIOR to buying the car. You see, as you say a Hybrid is a horse of a different color and most buyers understand that the EPA MPG is not the real number, so they look at real world numbers to make their decisions. So, they took that knowledge and looked at the feature set of the car and compared it to other cars with their real world MPG numbers. They then looked at the price and found that #1, the car was well UNDERPRICED for the feature set AND #2 there was no premium to buy a Hybrid over the standard fuel engine. Add all this up and you have the chance to by a car that gets VERY good MPG compared to others in it's class, along with a feature set that is well above MOST if not all in it's class and at a price that is well BELOW what other cars cost in it's class... Now, add a $ 1,050.00 pay out and you have a car that is one of the best purchases of their life... YMMV. To use your example: You want to purchase a New Sony PlayStation on Ebay and Sony advertise that games will cost $ 41 to purchase for it. You do some research and find that the games actually cost $ 50. Looking around you see that Xbox games and Nintendo games cost $ 50 also, but their system are much more expensive to purchase than the PlayStation. You send a message to the Ebay seller who assures you the cost if $ 41 for the games. You go ahead and purchase the PlayStation knowing that the games will cost you $ 50 dollars, but because the price of the Playstation is so much cheaper than the Xbox and Nintendo it makes it the best deal even at the $ 50 dollar game price. Weeks or Months after you receive the playstation, Sony changes their advertising to reflect the real world $ 50 price of games and sends you a check for $ 135.00 (3 games per year for 5 years * $ 9 each game) saying we were wrong and mislead you on the cost of the games. Please accept this good will payment and we hope you purchase from us again. You smile as you play grand theft auto on your new playstation that you love and think of all the things you can now buy with that additional $ 135.00. As a point clearification, the change in MPG is 15.5% not 18%. ;)

Don't know about the 2010, but the 2014 you can do it if you have both intelligent access keys. Remove the rubber covering in the cup holder, place first key in the backup slot. Press Start Stop and wait a few seconds. Press Start/Stop again and remove key. Insert the second key into the back slot then press start/stop. The factory code will be displayed in the information display in a few seconds... Page 69-70 of my manual.

Actually, I used to do the math at fill ups and found most of the time that the display is within a .1 or .2 of the actual gallons used... I think the furthest it was off was .5 (which was a one time outlier), so I stopped worrying about it considering that when you fill up it depends on the pump and when it auto shuts off will be different every time. So even using the "actual" methodology you described has it's own fluctuation of error involved and does not calculate the EXACT mileage. Of course over a large data set, it should even out and the % error come down, but I don't care to track every tank of gas in a book to find the average for the life of the car... Depending on how Ford programed the Onboard Computer, it should be MUCH more accurate than your method of calculation. They should be able to know exactly how much gas is sprayed each Revolution of the engine and then calculate a very accurate amount of gas used. I have no idea if they do that, hence why I do the math for the first few 1,000 miles to see how far off they are from each other. My guess is most of the error is in the "Pump" method and not the computer method. YMMV. BTW, I believe most people understand that the posted MPG on the sticker is a misrepresentation of what the actual MPG will be and disregard it completely. Ford's penalty of having any incorrect EPA calculated number is a $ 1,050 hit on every car they sold with the wrong numbers. For me, I feel that is a fair penalty for them and a fair compensation for me. Obviously you don't feel the same way... which is your choice; however, I think you'll find you are in the very small minority on that issue. Regardless, you have every right to try and get what you think is a fair resolution and to never buy another Ford again. That is what is great about choice, you can move your business elsewhere if you don't like the way Ford treated you. I wish you the best of luck in the future, and if you need any information I'd be happy the help you with any knowledge I may have.

Again, my suggestion would be to check the real world numbers prior to buying your next car. Over half of the Hybrids are MORE than 10% lower than the posted EPA number. It's not a "Ford/Lincoln" only thing... it's across the board. Maybe your next purchase won't leave as bad a taste in your mouth. Having said that... here is a typical tank of gas for me. It's slightly lower than normal as I was in the mountains this weekend, but for the most part I get between 40 and 42 mpg on a regular basis. 300 miles were on the way up and back from the NC mountains with speed limits between 55 and 70. I normally drive about 8 miles over the speed limit. While in NC, most speed limits were 45 mph with lots of red lights, but lots of hills too. One thing to check... in your driver settings of the car, make sure it's in Normal mode and not sport mode. I did a tank of gas in sport mode and only got 30-32 mpg. Makes a pretty big difference.

Out of the 37 hybrids listed by fuleeconomy.gov, only 11 have a better MPG than the 38 combined listed by the MKZ. Of those 11, only 4 or 5 are really in the same class. For your reference, here are the 11 listed better: Prius 50mpg Accord 47mpg Civic 45mpg Jetta 45mpg Fusion 42mpg Insight 42mpg Lexus CT 200h 42mpg Camery 41mpg Avalon 40mpg C-Max 40mpg Lexus ES 300h 40mpg So, 45 mpg to 38 mpg may be a bit difference, in the scale of other hybrids... it's in line with what you'd expect to see. The price of the MKZ is already pretty discounted when you look at the feature set that is included compared to similar cars that offer that same level of features. As for the battery warranty, I think it is a good one... however, what will happen is that at the 5 year mark most cars will be very close to that warranty limit on mileage and IF Battery prices have not dropped, then you run the risk of depreciated resale value... For me, I don't worry so much about it as I drive over 30,000 miles per year... so my car won't be worth crap in 5 years regardless of the battery warranty...

The idea is that the batteries will be much cheaper in 5 to 6 years so the cost to replace won't be anywhere near what it is today... However, I agree, the batteries are what will kill the resale, not the EPA MPG sticker on the window. The car was already priced well below market value for a similar featured car and the MPG are not out of line with other real world numbers from other hybrids (keep in mind that according to consumer reports more than 55% of the Hybrids on the market get more than 10% below the sticker MPG listing in real world values). I don't think the resale will take any hit on the lowering of the MPG, IMO.

Sounds like it's worth the $ 350 price the dealership is asking... why not just have them do it, or was labor not included in the that $ 350 ?

Daytime running lights are part of the Select Package 101A non-Hybrid or 201A Hybrid package..

ARe you talking about the DRL at the bottom of the car? If so, mine are white on my 2014 MKZ... I believe the turn signal lights up here also and would be orange... but the DRL are white.

You're one of the most confusing posters I've read... You first said, I then pointed out the real world numbers is what I go by and not the sticker MPG to which you hen said, Now to follow up with It seems to me, that for some reason that 45 listed EPA MPG on the sticker influenced your purchase as you wouldn't have purchased it if you knew it wasn't going to be 45. To which I say, on any future purchases it would behoove you to examine the real world numbers if that is a influencer in your decision... Also, on this thread you indicated you were only going to keep your car for 3 years... for a three year period the gas difference between 45 and 38 on 15k per year is $ 644 dollars. Now, Ford is paying you $ 1,050 for the extra cost in gas so you have an additional savings of $ 400 (all depending on your mileage of course). It seems they have also offered to extend the general service of the car for a period of time (which has some value too). Anyway, it's pointless to continue this as you have your view and it seems pretty stuck on being bent out of shape. I've spent way too much time already on this thread and need to get back to real life. Good luck to your future purchases... I hope they turn out better for you than this one.

Because you're upset that they've reset the MPG to the actual real world numbers. If you knew what the real world numbers were prior to buying it, why would you now want to "return" the car now? Also, if that was the case that you bought the car knowing the real world numbers, the $ 1050 offered by Ford would more than makeup for any depreciation. As a side note, I exceed the real world numbers on my 2014 MKZ at an average of 39.9 mpg for the first 4000 miles I've put on the car and I'm not a Hybrid type driver (never owned one before) and I drive my typical way as I do any other car I've owned. The first 2k or so of mileage was at 38, so the second 2k or so of mileage would be at 42 roughly (break in period maybe?). I've never owned a Ford nor a Lincoln prior to this one. I've owned all the German ones though along with the 2008 CTS when it was redesigned. I'm not a Lincoln fanatic or anything, but I do like this car and the feature set it offered for the price. They Hybrid was just a bonus (I've never owned a Hybrid either). As for the 40 mpg at highway speeds... I drive from Atlanta to Nashville often and regularly get 38+ mpg with my normal driving style. I have also once tried to be as efficient as possible in a challenge to see how well I could do and I got 42 mpg on the way to Nashville and 43 on the way home... That was driving at the speed limits and using the Eco Cruise most of the way. So yes, it's very possible to achieve 40+ mpg if you want to. As for the Blame, I'm not blaming you for the error Ford made, but Ford did step up and make an offer that I think is fair. What disagree with you on is that offer being fair... Any company can make a mistake (be it knowingly or not)... They were wrong and have made an offer to their client base. Now it's up to the client base to determine if that offer is good enough. For me, it is. I wouldn't hesitate to buy another Ford/Lincoln. Your "Mileage" may vary ;)

First off, I've never bought a car based on a window sticker MPG. I've always looked at the real world results that are found on many websites... I've also never bought a car for sticker price... Not sure what good the sticker is for anything other than "window dressing". My recommendation to you for the future would be to ignore anything and everything on the sticker and do some real research first. Maybe that will help keep you from finding yourself in this situation again. (BTW, consumer reports said that over 55% of the hybrids on the market fell at least 10% short of their sticker MPG in real world testing... and yes, Ford was dinged by them in that report). Secondly, I doubt there is much of any hit to the resale value due to MPG being lowered... maybe a few hundred dollars at most. Cars depreciate pretty quickly on their own, and even at 37 MPG the MKZ has a much better chance of holding it's value over the other hybrids as it's pretty undervalued right now at the point of sale. There are few if any other cars offering the same features at such a small price. The biggest concern I would have regarding resale value of a hybrid would be the battery life/cost to replace and not the MPG. The price I paid for the car was, in my opinion, under priced consider the REAL WORLD MPG figures and the feature set of the car. Third, you have every right to not buy another Ford. That is for sure your choice; however, I think that Ford has made a pretty fair offer for a mistake they made (even if knowingly). Of course, that's just my opinion. So maybe we'll just have to agree to disagree.

I'm a bit confused by your post... What is your issue here? Ford revised the MPG and are paying you the cost of gas for that difference for a 5 year period (assuming 15,000 miles per year). They have also offered extended maintenance which includes oil changes which you said was 70 dollars each, so that's additional savings to you. Not sure how Ford is responsible for your dealership screwing up your wheels... I would hold your dealership responsible for that. I don't know, sounds to me like Ford is being very fair with their offer... maybe I'm just not understanding your post?

On my Lincoln MKZ 2014 I read the fine print of the extended warranty and found it to be completely worthless... seemed to only cover the "hinges" and not much else that you'd want it to cover.

Actually, of all the colors... white is one of the ones that LEAST shows dirt... Black being the most. As for touchup paint on dings such... I've never had any luck with anyone's touchup when it comes to metallic coated paints. I've owned BMW, Audi, Cadillac and Acura... all pretty much sucked when it came to touching up a ding from a rock or anything else. The only thing I've found that works is to put a clear bra on the car Prior to getting the chip/ding. That way you keep from having to use any touchup pain.

What is the temperature outside the car? If the car is below 72 then the AC would blow warm/hot air out to heat up the car to 72 degree. Today in Atlanta it was 52 degree this morning and my car was blowing warm air at the 70 degree setting to warm up the car since it was colder than 70 inside the car.

Bay Greg... I wasn't trying to be a "smart ass" if it did come off that way I apologize. Point I was making is that it is not a plug in electric and is not designed for long EV range without and assist from the engine. If you baby your starts and don't have any hills you "may" get 1 mike in EV. The problem being the engine is designed to assist, so going pure EV mode take a lot of effort in driving style to accomplish. However, if you drive conservatively the gas usage is minimal and 50+ mpg are very doable. For that size car, I think those numbers are extremely good. Other cars are designed to go EV first and the go to gas after the battery drains. Mostly plug in cars do that... as an example (using your Toyota comment) the plug in Prius get's about 6 (EPA calculated) miles of pure electric, according to Green Car Report before having to switch over to the "Hybrid" engine for assist.

You may have already purchase another vehicle... However, I wanted to post in case anyone else reads this thread... As a comparison... I drive from Atlanta to Nashville on a regular basis and cruise at 80 mph for most of the trip. I get between 36-38mpg on those trips. The key is to use your ECO adaptive cruise and let the computer do the work instead of your foot. Now, that's not the 40+ you'd get at 62 mph or city driving... However, it's pretty damn competitive compared to most vehicles out there of similar size. Combine that with some city driving and I fully expect to be near 40 mpg average on the life of the car. I don't baby the car in any sense, but I don't full throttle it either... I drive "normal" with the exception of learning to break earlier and softer to regen the battery... but that's kinda fun with the break coach ') Anyway, I think the MKZ can make a very excellent high speed cruiser too... you just have to understand that you're not getting the MAXIMUM benefit from the hybrd at those speeds. However, at no premium upcharge for the Hybrid... for me it's like found money.

Electric only....??? 1 mile maybe if you're lucky... it's a Hybrid, it's not designed to be electric only.

If you're listening to the Sirius/XM source it's a very compressed signal and sounds muddy... Listening to High Quality digital music (no compressed WMA) sounds pretty dang good... High quality setting Pandora sounds good along with iTunes version. CD's sound good too.

Surprised to be driving this Beauty as I was set to go buy a Mercedes CLA 250 (had the check made out and ready to go for Monday Morning), but my wife was looking for a car too and before we went to Cadillac to buy her car (she's been in love with the CTS since it came out in 2008) we took a look at Lincoln. My wife wanted to drive every car in our price range/class before buying the Caddy and Lincoln was last on the list (I didn't even consider it for me). Well she drove the car on Saturday and I came back on Sunday and bought it for me... over the Mercedes. Here she is: 2014 Lincoln MKZ Hybrid White Platinum metallic tricoat Light Dune Leather seats 203a preferred package Technology Package Panoramic Skylight Multi-Contour seats w/Active Motion (LOVE THIS) Rear Inflatable seatbelts

Try Truecar.com also... I ran up a truecar price and printed the certificate and took it to a NON true car dealer. They matched the price and there was no hassle. The pricing I got on my 2014 MKZ hybrid (with 203a + skylight + tech + premium paint) was about 1k below invoice BEFORE the 500 conquest cash... so 1500 below invoice + the doc fee is a pretty good steal of a deal if you ask me. Best thing about the Truecar certificate, is that if a NON dealer won't match, take it to the truecar dealer. They are supposed to be bound to that pricing. My guess is pricing is going to be dependent on inventory and competition in the market you are in... so your experience may vary from mine. I'm in the Atlanta market, which has a TON of competition and volume. BTW, at 95% MSRP... the dealer is pricing you at just about Invoice, so depending on the competition and market volume... it's may be a good deal.